Krish Raghav – Comic Cities and Monkey Politics 城市漫画和猴子政治

Graphic artist 图画设计师

Interview on April 9 wandering and laughing through the blind alleys and markets around Beixinqiao with 大小 coffee

4月9日，畅聊于北新桥大小咖啡附近某个胡同和市集旁

KL: This was a strange coincidence. I was looking at the Split Works advertising with the comics and I was really envious and wondering who has doing them (I’d love to get someone to do something like that for Loreli) and the next day I saw you interviewed in Sixth Tone. I guess I asked the universe and the universe provided. Is this something you started doing Split Works promos?

KR: I only started drawing like five years ago and I always get a strange reaction when I say this but I can’t draw. It’s not a talent I possess. I didn’t draw as a kid. If you just give me a blank piece of paper and say draw a portrait, I can’t do it. It’s a very particular method and it feels like cheating when I tell people how I actually draw.

KL：这说来挺巧的，我当时在看Split Works的漫画广告，我很羡慕Split Works能有这么棒的设计师，我也想找这个人为Loreli做同样的事。第二天我就看见Sixth Tone采访了你，好像宇宙听到了我的请求。你是因为给Split Works做宣传才开始画画的吗？

KR：我在五年前才开始画画。当我说‘我不会画画’时，总会从别人那里得到很奇怪的回应。我没有这方面的天赋，我小时候就不懂画画。如果你给我张白纸，让我画一幅肖像，我都做不到。我的画画方法很特别，当我告诉别人这些时，他们觉得我在忽悠人。

KL: How do you draw?

KR: I take a lot of reference photos. I have a tripod with a camera timer and I pose myself in every position I want people in my comics to look like and use them as reference. And I have a light board so I use that to draw over them.

KL: So, you still physically draw them? You’re not using a Wacom tablet or something like that?

KR: No. It’s all one hundred per cent analogue. I draw, ink, paint and then scan.

KL：你是如何作画的？

KR：我拍了很多参考照片，我有一个三脚架和相机计时器，为了使漫画中的人物看起来更逼真，我会摆各种姿势，然后给自己拍照并作为参考。我有一块光板，我会在上面画画。

KL：所以现在还以这种方式画画吗？你不使用Wacom这种数位板或其他东西吗？

KR：完全不用。我是百分百手工，自己画，上墨，涂料和扫描。

KL: Then how did you start? You were just playing around with photos?

KR: I started doing stick figure comics but it was just a single idea- which was draw three panel or four panel comics but with no punch line. So, it would just be kind of slice of life. This was when I was living in Delhi. I had a boring job so this was a good way of passing the time. I had a boring but sort of interesting job where I would meet weird people and get into strange situations so I’d just draw comics about it. I kept practicing and then moved to Singapore where people started liking them on Facebook and it became a good way to keep them up-to-date once a month. I’d just post a comic of what was going on in my life.

KL：那你是怎么开始的？是从玩弄拍的照片开始的吗？

KR：我刚开始做一些简笔人物漫画，但比较单一，只有三或四面板，没有妙语连珠的句子。所以，像是生活中的小片段之类的。这是我在印度德里生活的时候，我当时有份很闷的工作，画画成了消磨时光的途径，工作虽乏味，但挺有趣。我每天遇见各种奇人奇事，然后将他们画成漫画，一直保持练习。之后我搬到了新加坡，我发现人们会在Facebook上赞我的漫画。之后我发现用这个方式每月更新我的漫画挺好的。我会发一些生活里的漫画到上面。

KL: So, it’s kind of a form of journaling?

KR: Sort of. Fast-forward two years and a friend in South Africa basically told me, “I have a gallery show with my comics coming up in Cape Town.” I knew her through work and she was like, why aren’t you doing this? Your comics are great. Start doing some art stuff. I said, I don't know where to start, and she was like, well my comic show is about dance music in Cape Town. I just went to clubs and drew pictures of people and did some research and wrote a few things and that’s it. It’s a show. It’s very simple. And I was like, huh, okay. I was really interested in sixties psychedelic music in Singapore so at the time I was researching “forgotten waves,” as I call them, entire genres that rose to huge prominence in different parts of Asia and then died. It’s part of this theory I have about independent music in Asia broadly – that is every new generation has to reinvent the wheel so it’s only very rarely that you get punk and post punk, this progression. In Asia, like India, Singapore, Malaysia, (Japan and Korea are exceptions, even China), you have these waves then they die and the next generation starts again.

KL:类似写日记的形式？

KR：差不多。两年之后，我一位南非朋友告诉我“我在开普敦即将有一个漫画展，”我通过工作认识她的，她给我的感觉是“你的漫画作品那么优秀，为什么不办个画展呢？”我说：“我不知道从何开始。”她说：“其实呢，我的作品是关于开普敦的舞蹈音乐的。我就去了酒吧，画里面的人，做了些研究，还写了些东西，仅此而已，非常简单的一个展。”我想还不错吧。我对新加坡六十年代的迷幻音乐非常感兴趣，那个时候我把它叫做“被遗忘的浪潮”，对此我还做了些研究。这整个类型的地位在当时大部分亚洲地区举足轻重，之后突然销声匿迹。这是我对亚洲独立音乐的一部分理解，那就是每一代人都不得不去创造新事物，仅有少数例子能像朋克变化到后朋克这个方式继续。在亚洲像印度、新加坡、马来西亚（中日韩是例外）都有这类浪潮，接着消亡了，然后下一代又重新拾起。

KL: I’ll definitely be hitting you up for some Singaporean Psychedelia.

KR: There was a book I discovered in the library, which was this very interesting oral history of psychedelic music in sixties Singapore, so I tracked down that guy and met him and he was just this character, he was amazing. He hated everything about modern music but he was involved in that scene and he knew everything about it. He showed me his record collection and I thought, this is a great comic so I pitched it to the Singapore art museum. They do this exhibition of young artists and they said, we’ll give you a corner just put your comics up there. So that was the first serious comic that I did and it paid a little bit of money so I established a little fund that I would always use for future projects. I used it to go to Moscow to visit a friend so I did a comic about Moscow, which did really, really well, then it kind of spiralled from there. I started selling them by pay-as-you-like online.

KL：我一定会跟你借点儿新加坡幻觉剂试试。

KR：我之前在图书馆发现一本很有趣的书，它是关于新加坡六十年代迷幻音乐的口述历史，于是我找到了这本书的口述者并且认识了他。他非常有个性，他厌恶现代音乐的一切同时他又是从事现代音乐这一行并且了如指掌。他给我看了他的唱片集，我觉得这整个能做成一部很棒的漫画，所以我把它投到了新加坡美术馆。这个美术馆当时在为年轻艺术家们做展览，他们对我说：我们给你一个角落去展览你的漫画作品。所以这算是我的第一个正式漫画展，他们付了一些钱，然后我建立了一个小基金库，准备用于未来的项目。之后我用这些钱去了莫斯科看望朋友，接着我做了很多关于莫斯科的漫画，那次非常成功。一切开始由此演变，我开始在线上以‘想付多少付多少’的方式售卖我的作品。

KL: So you sold them in published form?

KR: I haven’t done that in the last year or so. January 2016 was when I finished my Mexico City comic which was about 52 pages, the biggest thing I’ve done. That’s the last published thing I’ve released. I went to a few comic conventions to peddle that, in the US mainly. It’s pay as you want. You can read it for free but you can support it online if you like it. I’ve excerpted bits of that to websites and magazines.

KL：你是以他们已经出版的形式售卖的吗？

KR：在过去的一年里我还没有这样做。2016年1月，我完成了我的‘墨西哥城’漫画，大约有52页，这是我做过的最大的事情。这也是我最新发布的漫画集。我去了美国的几个漫画展兜售，它是随你付的形式，你可以免费翻阅，若你喜欢还可以在线支持。我从中摘录一些给了网站和杂志。

KL: It sounds like you’ve been doing this for awhile, you’re quite the established graphic artist now.

KR: Not really. That’s the problem I think, I’ve never been in one place long enough to be part of that scene. I think I came close in Singapore but then I left so I’m not part of it anymore. Since I left the Singapore comic scene has taken this dramatic kind of turn. This guy called Sonny Liew published this book that is extraordinary, I think it’s the most criminally under-recognised comic of all time. It’s a political history of Singapore but in comic form but it’s not advertised as such, it’s just a biography of a comic book artist. Anything more I say will be a spoiler. It’s an extraordinary book.

KL：感觉你做这行有一段时间了，现在你已经是初见成效的图画设计师了。

KR：不算是吧，我从来没有在一个领域呆那么久，并能融入成为其中一员，这是问题所在。当我对新加坡的圈子慢慢熟悉时，便离开了，所以我再也不属于那儿了。自从我离开新加坡后，漫画领域开始有了很大转变。一个叫Sonny Liew的家伙出版了一本书，这本书十分特别，我认为这本漫画圆圆没有得到它应得的赞赏和好评。这本书以漫画的形式描绘了新加坡的政治史，但它没有被包装成历史书，只是一个漫画艺术家的传记而已。我多说无益，不论如何，这是本很不同凡响的书。

KL: You’ve got a history lesson through the individual? That seems to be something that’s quite common in graphic novels with things like Persepolis and Maus.

KR: So, these are slight spoilers for the book. It’s called The Art of Charlie Chan and it’s a biography of a comic artist called Charlie Chan and how his art reflected Singapore’s evolution from a colony to Malaysian state to independent state. It gives you that sense of, how have I never heard of this guy? This is extraordinary! Charlie Chan’s art also mirrors the history of comic books as an art form so there are these three layers going on but Charlie Chan is a complete fiction and you only realize that about halfway through the book when you can’t find him on Google and you’re like, what’s going on? Then you realise, oh, it’s a fictional character. It channels this emptiness that I think many Asian artists feel where you think, what tradition am I part of, especially, comic book artists or musicians. You just feel like you’re always going to be a subset of a Western art form and he channels that paranoia and that emptiness so well. You want to believe Charlie Chan was real. You think, what if Singapore was the place where everything was invented? What if the graphic novel was first published in Singapore?

KL：通过个人的角度来了解历史，是吗？这在图画小说里还挺常见的，像《Persepolis》和《Maus》

KR：好吧，我剧透一下这本书的一些内容吧。它叫《The Art of Charlie Chan 》，是一个漫画家Charlie Chan 的自传，这本书是关于他的艺术是如何反应新加坡革命从殖民地到马来西亚政权再到独立状态的。这本书给你感觉像是，为什么我从来没听说过这个家伙？这简直太与众不同了！Charlie Chan 的艺术也反映了漫画小说作为艺术形式的历史，所以他的小说有分三个不同的层次，但 Charlie Chan其实是完全虚构的。你只能在读到一半，还一头雾水并且谷歌不到任何关于他的信息时才接着意识到，噢，原来这是虚构的角色。它传达的是一种虚无感，许多亚洲艺术家，特别是漫画家和音乐家都会想——我在哪里思考？我属于哪种文化？你总是感觉自己从属于西方艺术。他将这种空虚和偏执传达得很好。你希望Charlie Chan 是真实的，你想如果新加坡是所有事物的发明地，那会是怎样的？如果图画小说在新加坡首次出版，那又会是一番怎样情景？

KL: That sounds utterly fascinating. When you see something that’s so layered and sophisticated, is that something that you try and achieve with your work as well?

KR: Yeah, this book had the happy effect that it gives me something to show what I’m aiming for which didn't exist before. When people would say, who inspires you as a comic book artist, I would say Alison Bechdel but then her work is mostly focused on sexuality and her family and the psychological complications of being queer which was a huge influence but mostly in style and tone. This is much more politically close to what I want to talk about. Most people in the past would be like, your work is like Guy Delisle. A lot of people love his work, but I personally think he’s terrible! He’s a French Canadian comic book artist. He’s done about five books on different cities in Asia. So there’s Pyongyang, Shenzhen, Yangon…

KL：这听上去太吸引人了。当你看到一些很复杂有有又层次的东西，你会尝试去完成他们吗？

KR：是的，这本书有个很好的效果就是它能代表我所追求的目标，这是我以前从未有过的。，当人们问我：“是谁启发你去做一位漫画艺术家？”我会说：“Alison Bechdel。”她的作品主要集中在性意识、家庭、和作为酷儿(queer)所带来的精神上的问题。这些对她作品的基调和风格影响深远，这些在政治上更加接近我想表达的，以前人们总说：“你的作品很像Guy Delisle。”有很多人喜欢这个家伙的作品，但我个人认为他的作品不忍卒看。他是一个法裔加拿大漫画书艺术家，他在以亚洲不同的城市为中心完成了5本作品，有平壤、深圳、仰光......

KL: What is it about his work that you revile so much?

KR: He’s just…a bit of a dick? He’s very open about this. He’s an “expat” animation designer and gets hired by all these studios as an expat consultant and then he does these comics about these cities. There’s moments of real beauty in his books, and I fully admit he’s very talented…but there’s just something about the point of view they represent that turns me off.

KL：他的作品是关于什么的？以至于你深恶痛疾？

KR：他就是。。挺令人讨厌的？他也不否认这个事实。他是一个“老外”动画设计师并且被很多工作室雇佣为外籍顾问，然后为这些城市做漫画。他的作品里有很多精妙绝伦的风景，我承认他的才华，但他表达的观点就不知道为什么让我感觉厌烦。

KL: Are they through the lens of an expat?

KR: Yeah. Like the Yangon comic, I’m familiar with Yangon, and he’s like, oh, I’m an expat. I stayed in this expat colony called Golden Valley. And it’s like, well, that doesn’t excuse it. You can’t just say that and get away with it. But the thing is, people love his books! And I’m like, why, why!? Why is this the gold standard for comics about cities because it is a very low bar but his market is people who are travellers. It plays into that whole travel-industrial complex.

KL：因为这些观点都片面地通过一个外籍人的镜头传达的？

KR：对，拿他的仰光漫画作品为例，我很了解仰光，而他就会觉得：我是个老外，我呆在一个被称为黄金山谷的海外殖民地。我觉得，恩，这个不够。你不能说完这种话后什么也不解释。关键是，好多人喜欢他的作品，为什么？为什么！为什么因为这里有很低的门槛所以他的作品是城市漫画的黄金标准？但是他的作品的主要读者都是游客，它在整个旅游业举足轻重啊。

KL: So that white filter is recognisable as close to their experience?

KR: Yeah. And he kind of underscores all these cities as exotic so it’s comfortable. It’s this ‘other’ place.

KL: As far as you writing about cities, have you done one about home? Is Delhi home?

KR: It’s complicated. My dad passed away two years ago and my last published comic was about him so I don't really have a home. He was my last close Indian family member. I have two brothers who are in different parts of the world. I guess Delhi is close, Singapore is close, somewhere between those two. And Beijing is coming close now though they’ll never allow me to call this home.

KL：所以这种“白人滤镜”让这些读者联系到自己的经历？

KR：是的，而且他把所有城市都强调得很异域风情，让他们容易消化。这是“另一个”地方。

KL：在你所写的城市里，你有写过自己的家吗？你把德里看成家吗？

KR：这有点复杂，我父亲在两年前去世，我最新出版的漫画集是关于他的，所以我没有真正的家。他是最后一个跟我亲的印度家人，我有两个兄弟，他们分别在世界的两端，我觉得德里可以称为家，新加坡也是，北京也越来越像家了，虽然很多人叫我永远不要把这儿称为家。

KL: Are you making a book about Beijing?

KR: No. I’m not working on one about Beijing. I’m working on one broadly about the experiences of young Chinese artists in India. I realised recently that I know this diverse cross-section of Chinese dancers, musicians and writers who are all kind of fascinated by India and it’s interesting for me to look at their ‘gaze’, if you will. They’re all what you call millennials, and they are looking at India in a very particular way – very different from what I think is the usual outward gaze of young Chinese today.

To many here, India is, broadly speaking, like “Africa” for Westerners. It’s a poor country that is the source of all exotic things and they see some kind of pure essence for their art and that’s fascinating to me because that didn’t exist a generation ago.

KL：你有在计划做一本关于北京的漫画集吗？

KR：我没有这个打算。我正在做的一本有关中国年轻艺术家在印度的经历。我最近意识到我从不同的截面认识了一些对印度感兴趣的中国舞蹈家、音乐家、作家，能够看到他们“凝视”的方面还是很有趣的。他们是所谓的“千禧一代”，以一种独特的视角看印度，与目前大部分的中国年轻艺术家向外看世界的视角完全不一样。在许多西方人眼里，印度像是“非洲”一样的穷国家，也是一切异国事物的源泉，他们给艺术找到了一些纯粹的东西，并且这些足以吸引我，因为这种看法在一上一代人里不曾存在过。

KL: Why do you think they’ve suddenly turned to India as a source of fascination?

KR: Because India was so absent here in so many ways. Indian dance in particular wasn’t here and now there is an Indian classical dance school in Beijing run by one of these people. She says for the parents who enroll their kids there it’s like learning ballet. It’s this beautiful, foreign, unique art form.

KL：为什么你觉得他们为了寻找魅力的源泉，要将眼光转向印度？

KR：因为印度风格在中国是很罕见的，特别是这里没有印度舞蹈，最近北京有一个印度古典舞蹈学校，由其中一位艺术家办的，她说，那些把孩子送来这儿学习芭蕾的家长都觉得印度舞风格很美丽、异域风情、很独特。

KL: How recently has this begun? I went and saw an Indian dance troupe during the year of friendship between China and India after that little skirmish on the border when they started that diplomatic venture of sharing culture [2014]. It’s not that recent is it?

KR: I think she opened the school about four or five years ago. It’s a really lovely place. It’s the Tamil dance form and I’m Tamil so it’s really surreal to see it.

KL：这个学校是怎么开始的？2014年，我在中印友谊年的时候去见了一个印度舞蹈团，当时外交边境小规模冲突刚过，那会儿他们开始开展共享文化外交政策，所以这应该不是最近的事吧？

KR：我感觉他们四、五年前就开办这所学校了，那是个很特别的地方，他们教的是泰米尔舞蹈，我是泰米尔人，感觉像是穿越时空才见到它。

KL: How far into the project are you? How many artists do you have so far?

KR: Very early days, just researching it for now. I have five domains - dance, music, literature, history and film. That’s what I’m imagining for now but hopefully as I talk to them I will find more.

KL：你的项目计划多久了？目前为止，你召集了多少个艺术家？

KR：很早之前了，现在是在调研，我目前涉及五个领域：舞蹈、音乐、文学、历史、电影。这是目前我能想到的，希望以后能挖掘更多的艺术家。

KL: Considering there was this huge trend toward this in the sixties from western countries with The Beatles and the Maharishi and Ravi Shankar that was almost overwhelming at the time that they created a mythology of India that was purely for that time period. Delhi via Carnaby Street. How does this iteration work? Is it still looking at the instrumentation and style? Is it somehow filtered through the western sixties experience? How are the millennials approaching it?

KR: It’s a bit of both. The musicians that I’ve spoken to, for example, their approach is basically, I’m going to spend a month travelling around the south of India going to classical and folk music concerts and then recording samples from all of them. Then I’m going to use these samples and these signatures in my own electronic music. So there is an echo of just put a sitar in it but I haven’t heard any of the songs inspired by it yet. It could be interesting if the engagement is deeper.

KL：鉴于这是60年代的大趋势，从披头士、马哈日世到拉维·香卡，当时基本是压倒性的趋势，他们创造了纯粹属于那个时代的印度神话——德里的卡比那街。这种重复是怎么奏效的？它仍注重乐器和风格吗？它是如何通过西方六十年代的经历提取精华的？这些“千禧一代”是如何重拾这些的？

KR：乐器和风格都关注吧，例如我曾经谈过的音乐家，他们的形式基本上是那样的。他们会花上一个月的时候游览印度南部，去一些古典的民间音乐会，从中记录样本，然后他们会利用这些样本和经典的声音放到他们自己的电子音乐里，所以你会听到《just put a sitar in it》里有回声，我还没听过任何由它带来灵感的音乐。如果我接触更深，会更有趣。

KL: How do they view the differences between China and India? I often use it as a point of reference for students of the effects of democracy and socialism on developing countries over the last however many decades. How do they relate to the difference?

KR: Comparing their political systems?

KL: No, I guess I mean what it means to be Chinese and what it means to be Indian? Or is this just a creative thing?

KR: It’s a spectrum because a few of the people I spoke to think it’s just this messy dysfunctional place. A lot of folks get caught up in the middle of protest rallies when they’re there. They don’t see it as an expression of political freedom but rather, “there’s nothing working now, there are cops everywhere and all the shops are closed.” And, for the women specifically, it is an extremely dangerous place if they’re travelling alone because many of them were in second tier cities in India and they see that as an expression of the political reality. And let’s be clear: India, in many parts, IS a deeply unsafe, misogynist, problematic place in that sense and that’s a completely fair reading.

KL：他们怎么看到中印之间的差距的？我经常将它作为在过去几十年里民主和社会主义对发展中国家的影响的参考，然后给我的学生们提示。他们如何将这些不同联系到一起？

KR：你是指比较政治制度吗？

KL：不，我的意思是，它对于中国人来说是什么意思？对印度人来说又意味着什么？还是它只是一个创意类的事情。

KR：这有一个范围，一些和我聊过的人认为印度是一个混乱的地方。很多人在印度时会被迫堵在抗议集会中，他们不认为那是在表达政治自由，而是认为“不能工作了，到处都是警察，所有商店都关闭了。”特别是对于妇女来说，如果她们单独旅行，会十分危险，毕竟他们中很多人在二线城市并且他们认为这是政治现状。说清楚点就是：在印度很多地方都是矛盾突出，极其危险，并且有厌恶女人倾向的。从这点上，他们的理解是有根基的。

KL: Well, walking around Beijing at night is definitely a different experience to walking around Delhi, that’s for sure.

KR: They’ve grown up with this reality and their experience of a city is closer to Seoul or Tokyo rather than Delhi or Jakarta.

KL: I also think it’s different to Melbourne, where I’m from. When they talk about it being dangerous here in Beijing and to be careful with your things, it’s like trust me, it’s not! I stagger around here at night by myself and I would never do that in Melbourne.

KR: When people tell me about touts and that people will try to cheat me here, I’m like, you have no idea how bad it can be. I’m really fond of Delhi, it’s one of my favourite places, but I don't recommend it to anyone. It is a city, like Moscow, it doesn’t care what people think of it. It’s just there. Take it or leave it. And it is a ridiculous place, really ugly sometimes but you experience things there you wouldn't get anywhere else.

My favourite story about Delhi is that our ex-mayor was killed by monkeys and (this is where it gets speculative) he was elected on a platform of being strong against monkeys.

KL：确实是，夜游北京和夜游印度德里是完全不一样的经历。

KR：北京的人从小在这样的环境里长大，他们拥有的城市体验很像首尔、东京，而不是德里或者雅加达。

KL：我觉得和墨尔本也不一样，当他们说在北京要注意安全，看好贵重物品的时候，都是一副认真严肃的脸，但我照样半夜三更一个人在路上摇摇晃晃，但我在墨尔本从来不这样。

KR：当人们讨论这里有人会用这些招数来骗我的时候，我想：你根本都不知道有其他更糟的地方。我非常喜欢德里，它是我最喜欢的城市之一。但我不会把它推荐给任何人，它就像是莫斯科，不在乎人们怎么想它，它就一直在那儿，要么你来，要么你离开。但德里又是一个脏到至极的地方，有时你会经历一些你在其他地方不会经历的东西。德里有个故事我特别喜欢，那就是它的前市长被猴子杀死了，而他竞选时的其中一个观点就是坚决反对猴子。（这也是令人思考的地方）

KL: Those big langurs [large grey monkeys seen commonly in Indian cities]?

KR: The langurs are actually government employees. I swear this is all true. The langurs were hired by the government to be deterrents of the Rhesus, the original residents that were terrorising everyone. The resident monkeys were supposedly scared of the langurs so you’ll see langurs patrolling government buildings mainly to prevent other monkeys from getting in.

KL: Wow! Well, they’re very intimidating.

KR: There was also a glorious government job posting asking for professional ‘monkey disguise’ experts. Delhi monkey politics, I love it.

KL：那些大的叶猴（灰色猴子）在印度常见吗？

KG：那些叶猴实际上是政府雇员，我发誓这一切是真的。政府雇用这些叶猴去震慑恒河猴（最开始吓居民的猴子们），后来这些恒河猴都很怕叶猴，所以你会看到叶猴在政府大楼前巡逻，主要是防止其他种类的猴子进入政府办公大楼。

KL：天哪，这太可怕了！

KR：他们有一个很好玩的政府职位，要求职业“猴子伪装”专家，我们叫它“猴子政治”，我很喜欢。

KL: As a city, how does Beijing factor into your art?

KR: I did a semester here in 2011 and I got a lot of my personal comics out of the way. Though, I look back at them now and think they’re terrible which is always the problem with personal experience because you’re reflecting your current knowledge of a place, which, as a foreigner in a city, is hopefully outdated in six months. If it’s not something is wrong. So, I’m always scared some of my older comics will start to feel obsolete whereas stuff where I’m writing about other subjects and researching feel like they’ve stood the test. Especially when you write about cities.

KL: 北京作为一城市，是如何成为你艺术的一部分的？

KR：我在2011年的时候花了一个学期完成了一大部分我的个人漫画，虽然现在回过头看会觉得很糟糕，可能总是因为个人经验的问题。毕竟作为一个外国人，你反应的是当下你对一个城市的理解，它们六个月后也就过时了。若没有过时肯定哪里出错了。所以我总是害怕我以前的作品开始变得过时了，我希望我正在创作和研究的东西可以经受得住考验，特别是当你创作关于城市的作品时。

KL: So, what do you have to say about old Beijing? Is there something currently that you’d like to get off your chest, visually?

KR: I’d really like to draw something about the waves of the music scene. As I’ve seen them, anyway. There’s always a creative peak and then a trough and then a peak and it feels like we’re coming out of a trough right now. Things are happening that weren’t happening last year. There’s a sudden wave of new bands and new ideas but again, I think it can only work as a very static snapshot of a particular month and year rather than a broader story of Beijing.

KL：关于老北京，从视觉的角度，你目前有什么想要一吐为快的吗？

KR：如果有机会，我想画下一些音乐现场，画家总会经历创作高峰，再到低谷期，再返回高峰，现在又正在走出低谷期。去年没有发生的事情，现在正在经历着。我突然会蹦出一个新乐队或者别的新想法，但我觉得这是一个静态的一闪而过的印象而已，只在特定的某月某年里出现，而不是北京大范围的故事。

KL: Is it slightly satisfying that you are able to use your art in your role at Split Works?

KR: Yeah, I love it. I did it as a test for the festival last year and then people came up to the merch tent, which I was running at the festival, and asked, those comics that you did, can we buy them? So many people did that and I was like, wait, what? I should have sold them. I’ve missed an opportunity here.

KL：你能在Split Works里使用你的艺术作品，你开心吗？

KR：是的，我太开心了！去年的一个节日上，我做了一个测试，有很多人走到我们的摊位上问我：能否买下这些漫画集。我很惊讶，当时我本可以售卖的，但我错过了一个千载难逢的机会。

KL: Did you have some false humility and ask, oh what comics? They have nothing to do with me but please, tell me more.

KR: I asked which one they wanted to buy and they said, can we just get a collection, or something? I was like, huh? So hopefully this year we can sell them and I can do more of them.

KL: The bands must get a kick out of it as well, right?

KR: Yeah, one of the bands found me and they were really happy with it so they signed it for me and they posted it on their website and asked if they could use panels from it to promote stuff. That was cool.

KL：你有没有很虚伪的问他们：“噢？什么漫画呀？”给我多爆点料吧。

KR：我又问他们想买哪一个作品，他们说只想买一整系列的。然后我都不知道说什么了。希望今年作品可以大卖。

KL：这乐队也会乐在其中吧？

KR：是啊，有一支乐队找到我，他们很开心，还在上面签了名，并且张贴到他们的网站，之后还问我能不能用我的几页漫画去宣传。我觉得挺酷的。